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Talk:Fourth Shinobi World War/Archive 1
Five? Why does it say that "the five kage" didn't give Madara the remaining beasts. The hokage (both real and acting) was not present. (talk) 14:32, March 24, 2010 (UTC) It was later relayed to the Hidden Leaf anyways, and they agreed...so i guess it doesn't matter much, add it if you like.--Silverblade1 (talk) 15:57, March 24, 2010 (UTC) Tailed Beasts imortal? Go to talk: Tailed Beasts. Thomas Finlayson (talk) 20:58, June 11, 2010 (UTC) Eventually we're going to need the Battles on individual pages From what it looks like, this is going to be a long war and we can't keep all the battles in one page. Should we also start working on a timeline too?--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 05:21, November 5, 2010 (UTC) :None of these entries are or are likely to be long enough to absolutely need separate articles. I'd also argue that Bee v Kisame and Danzo v Sasuke aren't really events of this war, as one or more of the involved parties in each battle were not aware that war had been declared. :Also, the basic structure of this article is very different from all similar articles on the wiki. That's partly because this war isn't being reduced to the occasional flashback, so that's fine. But the running tally of participants and wins/loses I see as problematic. ~SnapperT '' 17:47, November 5, 2010 (UTC) How do you know? How do you know that there are 80,000 shinobi and samurai? There is obviously more than 80,000 ninja in the narutoverse! Probrably more than 80,000 ninjas in a village![[User:Gennojo Kuchiki|'''Don't look at me!!]] [[User_talk:Gennojo Kuchiki|'Just talk...']] 15:15, November 26, 2010 (UTC) :We know it because that's how much Zetsu read there was in the info Kisame stole from the alliance. Omnibender - Talk - 15:34, November 26, 2010 (UTC) :We need to start including more references. --Daleadil (talk) 18:09, November 26, 2010 (UTC) :Besides, even if there were more that 80,000 shinobi in a village, do you not see the problem with a shinobi village deploying ALL of its troops? Think about Suna, for instance, and how vulnerable it would be to a neutral village like Kusa? It makes sense that there are more than that, but does it not also make sense not to deploy all of them? Timeel39 (talk) 00:19, January 22, 2011 (UTC) Other kage Where are the other kage? Since the kages are the most powerfull ninjas in the world i would think that they would be in charge of the division. Where is Onoki, Mei, Tsunade?Scott sswagg 16:27, November 26, 2010 (UTC) :Being busy with other aspects of the war like supplies, home front defence, logistics, and medical backup? —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 16:46, November 26, 2010 (UTC) add the battle shouldnt we add the battle that is going on between kakashis division and the as icall it the kekkei division.Scott sswag (talk) 05:59, December 20, 2010 (UTC) i agree,its one of the on going battles( i think their are liek 4 now)and we have plenty of information about it. (talk) 07:11, March 20, 2011 (UTC) :It's there They just aren't called the "Kekkei division" --Cerez☺ (talk) 11:50, March 20, 2011 (UTC) What about in the anime the shinobi that kabuto used to stall until mu had enough chakra to summon MadaraFanking (talk) 18:38, December 14, 2013 (UTC) Allied Forces' Ambush In all maps seem so far, the Surprise Attack Division is shown to be in the Land of Hot Water, and Kakashi's Division is in the Land of Frost. The battle between the SAD and Akatsuki's SADP, from what we know from SAD's location, happened in the Land of Hot Water. I understood that the Third Division moved into the Land of Hot Water to help them once Zabuza, Haku, Gari, and Pakura moved in, but the map shows them in the Land of Frost. I don't think SAD moved back, they'd have to go forward to reach Mountains' Graveyard. It seems to me that the Allied Shinobi have updated their maps according to this development, and that we haven't seen any communication between the SAD and someone who isn't from the Third Division seems to support that. Thoughts? Omnibender - Talk - 10:44, February 4, 2011 (UTC) Afterlife I noticed this page mentions Sasori returning to the "Afterlife". As an afterlife ia no small matter, someone thinking it exists in the plotline might not be seeing the series setting quite as Misashi Kishimoto intended. I tend to speedread comics, so if anyone remembers any mention of the afterlife, it should be discussed in the talk page here. Michael Flores (talk) 01:55, March 11, 2011 (UTC) :Things like heaven were mentioned by Zabuza before Kabuto wiped his personality, and Kabuto mentioned that for him to be able to bring someone back, the soul needs to be in the pure world. I'm not familiar with the religious and cultural aspects of the term, but it implies it's something like an afterlife. We wouldn't add it to articles if we didn't have a base for it. Omnibender - Talk - 02:19, March 11, 2011 (UTC) ::The Pure World or Pure Land is a kind of afterlife. It's a place created by the Amida Buddha where those born into it are personally instructed by her and numerous bodhisattva in the way to reach Nirvana and escape Samsara. Basically, it's a one-way trip to Nirvana and all you have to do is revere the Amida Buddha in life and/or call out to her when you die. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 13:08, March 11, 2011 (UTC) OK. I tend to speed-read through comics. Michael Flores (talk) 00:34, March 12, 2011 (UTC) Shikaku Nara's Promotion. In the recent issue, the Raikage gave Shikaku Nara (Shikamaru's dad) the power to COMMAND the allied shinobi forces. You can find this conversation on page 7 of Manga #537. Does this not count as a promotion? We should list that as part of his rank, "Proxy Commander of Allied Shinobi Forces." Or something to that affect. Thoughts? --Daleadil (talk) 20:55, May 7, 2011 (UTC) :Yes we know this. It's already mentioned in his article and seeing as he's the Chief Strategist all he's doing is usurping a line of command. I don't think that we should make it an "official" thing, not that it isn't.--Cerez365™☺ 21:00, May 7, 2011 (UTC) Can this war been seen in the anime? I just want to know, can i see this on anime? :Madara declared war in episode 205 (current episode is 212), and since the battle against Danzo wasn't a part of the war, the short answer is: no, not yet. Jacce | Talk | 15:43, May 20, 2011 (UTC) Minor Nations What are the minor nations doing during this war? Do they know what's going on and are they sending help and supplies or are they just sitting back minding their own business? Nadara (talk) 19:12, November 26, 2011 (UTC) To answer your question I think the smaller nations are aware but choose not to participate because of their small numbers of people and supplies but from the couple of places naruto has visited while sailing to the island in the land of lightning it seems some of nations send food and medical supplies to the main villages. WillofOP (talk) 19:20, November 26, 2011 (UTC)WillofOP :They evacuated to the greater nations. The war was waged between Tobi and the Five Great Shinobi Countries. They're not really a part of it.-Cerez365™ 19:24, November 26, 2011 (UTC) So the smaller shinobi villages are pretty much sitting back and hoping the Five Great Shinobi Countries win this. Nadara (talk) 19:55, November 26, 2011 (UTC) :When asked who the Allied Forces of WWII were, most people would list the US, Britain, Australia, Canada, China, and maybe New Zealand, South Africa, and the Commonwealth nations. This doesn't mean the Netherlands, Belgium, Greece, Czechoslovakia, Mexico, Norway, Yugoslavia, and dozens of other smaller nations didn't fight on the Allies' side as well. :Just because the Alliance is lead by the Five Great Shinobi Power and mostly consists of their shinobi, doesn't mean the smaller nations don't have their roles as well. We simply don't focus on them. —ShounenSuki (talk | | translations) 01:08, November 27, 2011 (UTC) Village icons instead names In "Allied Shinobi Forces" section table, the village names its said instead of their icons, like: :Naruto Uzumaki , Konohagakure instead : Naruto Uzumaki The second way would be best, not? SKnight • Talk • 22:15, January 21, 2012 (UTC) Like that: Cool ^-^ SKnight • Talk • 22:26, January 21, 2012 (UTC) That seems good to me. There's no drawbacks to it that I can think of. :-) Skitts (talk) 22:27, January 21, 2012 (UTC) :Thanks SKnight • Talk • 22:32, January 21, 2012 (UTC) I don't have a problem with this. Two things though... I think if we add "!! Loyalty" you can get another heading just for that. You may also want to ask Simant if there's an easier/automatic way to get the icons to show up in the table.--Cerez365™ 13:50, January 22, 2012 (UTC) Naruto and the 4th World War I may be a bit late but I have a question. In the most recent anime filler Adventures at Sea Arc, it appears that Naruto knows about the war. In the manga he has no realization about the war until Chapter 535. Is this a massive plot-hole or a misunderstanding on my part? --Questionaredude (talk) 01:50, February 17, 2012 (UTC) :Most likely a plot-hole in my opinion, though if there are no events in that arc contradicting it, I think it might be possible for Naruto to have known that there would be a war, but not expect it to break so soon. Still most likely a plot-hole. Omnibender - Talk - 02:09, February 17, 2012 (UTC) Epic and Glorious Cuts Yeah. The last battle was like a month of chapters but it grew to epic proportions here. So I made it smaller. Much smaller. I feel the other places should be shorted as well.--'TheUltimate3' ~Keeper of Lore~ 14:56, February 18, 2012 (UTC) :Those cuts are necessary once in a while. Snapper usually makes them. Omnibender - Talk - 16:00, February 18, 2012 (UTC) Shikaku Nara Where has it been stated in the manga that Shikaku is the chief strategist? -- (talk) 01:07, February 28, 2012 (UTC) :If it wasn't stated implicitly, it was implied in chapter 525.--Cerez365™ 01:21, February 28, 2012 (UTC) Anime Only Given I think the anime is going to drag these out here and there, is it worth while to note Anime Only Battles like Team 8 vs. the White Zetsu in the mines and such? :Yes. If it happens in either the anime or manga, put it in. If you feel like you must, but an anime only tag in the duration but add it.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 10:52, October 4, 2012 (UTC) Locations, locations Should the Land of Lightning coast and desert get pages? They seem to be important enough having been locations in the war. --OmegaRasengan (talk) 01:35, February 28, 2013 (UTC) separate page for final battle? I think we can all agree that this has got to be the longest battle that Naruto has ever fought, and it just keeps getting bigger and bigger by chapter, and it has so many surprises and more people gets added to both sides , that I'm surprised that they didn't make it into a page. So I was thinking, why don't we? Justin Holland (talk) 11:56, May 24, 2013 (UTC) :I see no reason to break this page up. Long pages are not an inconvenience per se, especially one like this that is just supposed to give you bare statistics. It may be necessary though, to trim this page down.--Cerez365™ (talk) 12:47, May 24, 2013 (UTC) ::One problem with breaking it is where the split would happen, there were three fights happening at the same time, Obito was using the jinchuriki to fight Naruto, Bee, Guy and Kakashi, the kage were fighting Madara, Sasuke and Itachi were fighting Kabuto and the current battle is just continuing the Obito/Naruto fight.TricksterKing (talk) 12:55, May 24, 2013 (UTC) maybe rearrange to make it look they are the same and not disjointed? Justin Holland (talk) 20:02, May 24, 2013 (UTC) :I had just separated the beginning of the fight to Ten-Tails revival, and the "Second Battle" between the entire Alliance vs Madara/Tobi/Ten-Tails. This is more or less a bandaid because on a very technical level, it is still the exact same fight. Cerez is trimming this page would do wonders.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 21:16, May 24, 2013 (UTC) ::Enforcing a hard limit on how long each "battle" summary should be would do wonders for size reduction. Most only need to be a paragraph, and none need to be more than two. ::The battle particulars given before the summaries are also odd. Location is usually indicated in the "battle" name and Combatants and Outcome are already stated in the summary proper. Duration is also of debatable value. Cutting all of those won't have much impact on size, but it will reduce white space at least. ''~SnapperT '' 02:59, May 25, 2013 (UTC) Battle Against The Eye Of The Moon Plan Finished? Sorry, but I just can't understand why The Battle Against The Eye Of The Moon Plan is written to be over on this page. The battle is titled "Battle Against The Eye Of The Moon Plan", so technically, the battle isn't finished. The Eye Of The Moon Plan has not been Commenced, so I strongly believe that the battle shouldn't be typed on this page to be over. The two battle's on the page should be joined as one fight.--Kadio123 (talk) 19:30, June 19, 2013 (UTC) Since the battle against the ten-tails is over. should we call the new battle "Second Battle against the Eye of moon plan" or Battle against Obito Uchiha and Madara Uchiha--User:Staff Sergeant Jack Jackson | Talk Page | 08:12, July 9, 2013 (UTC) Final Battle I was think that we could do something like put final battle part 1, part, etc. for the final battle. Like Battle against the Eye of the Moon plan ( final battle pt.I)(final battle pt.II) Justin Holland (talk) 19:58, July 19, 2013 (UTC) :Under no circumstances, will these battles get the label "Final Battle". Its unnecessary, and for lack of a better term, looks incredibly stupid in an article. Why you seem so adamant about it is beyond my comprehension, but nevertheless, they won't be added. --[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 21:15, July 19, 2013 (UTC) ::the final battle label was just a thought, just answer me this: are the battles against the users of the ten-tails really just two separate battles, if not then are you sure there isn't any way we can make it clearer that these battles are just parts of the same huge battle, cause i feel that there might be a chance it could confuse people. Justin Holland (talk) 02:57, July 20, 2013 (UTC) :::Technically no they are not two separate battles. But there is a noticable shift in how the battle played out. Before it was a battle between ninja, which was the first part during the day, then it became a battle between a demon, which is the battle at night. :::Also, friggin hell look at the size of those sections. They can be pruned sure but they have been going on for almost two years. No way in hell they can functionally fit in one section and it not be completely and totally broken. :::And nobody reading the article is going to confused, if one were to simply read the section there is a very clear change of when one battle was considered "over" and the new battle "began". The only way someone can be confused is if they were irrecoverbly stupid and at that point their fate is not in our hands.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 11:28, July 20, 2013 (UTC) I have to concur with Ultimate. There is no way to cut any of this war into sections or even label this battle at the moment as "The Final Battle". Who's to say that this isn't just the beginning, middle or 5th of 10 battles? Kishi will be sure to let us know and until then, we shouldn't label any as such. SusanooUnleashed (talk) 11:33, July 20, 2013 (UTC) I think, battle agaist ten-tails has ended. Can we add Battle against Madara or not? Where is Kankuro & Mifune? Where are Kankuro and Mifune's groups while everyone is fighting against Obito and Madara? I thought Kankuro, at least, was still in the fight.--Aburame41 (talk) 23:53, August 7, 2013 (UTC) :Last we was Kankuro, he was being taken to a medical compound after he inhaled some of Ibuse's poison. His division wasn't that big, I think only Sai is in the main battlefield. Mifune's group is either waiting for an opening, per Shikamaru, or fighting Ten-Tails' spawns. Omnibender - Talk - 01:40, August 8, 2013 (UTC) That's pretty much what I was thinking. It's a bummer though since I was hoping Kankuro would show up with a small puppet brigade or something similar to Temari and her wind team. Thanks for the clarification though.--Aburame41 (talk) 22:51, August 8, 2013 (UTC) Date Accuracy Shall we adjust the descriptions of the War's Day according to the info given in Chapter 643? That would mean that the War started on October 8 (Day One), reached its climax on October 9 (Day Two) and is currently happening on October 10 (Naruto's Bday, Kushina's, Minato's and Rin's death anniversary). Abe 20:20,8/18/2013 :I was about to ask this question, I think this should be added on the summary of this war in the beginning. http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a553/anaspet06/Shakhmootssign_zps2a261e68.png(Contact) 12:35, August 20, 2013 (UTC) ::Aren't you all forgetting that it's Naruto's birthday tomorrow, meaning he isn't yet 17 years old and there's no October 10th yet? Seelentau 愛議 00:30, August 21, 2013 (UTC) ::: That's exactly my problem with all this conjecture about changing everyone's ages and the dates on everything. The chapter in which it is actually October 10th is even out yet. Manga-world-wise, it isn't until tomorrow, therefore Naruto hasn't aged, and it is still, technically, the 9th. ~ 'Ten Tailed Fox 01:21, August 21, 2013 (UTC) ::::Yup. So no change in his age, but in everyone elses. Also, write something like "Night 2" in the article, don't know. Maybe the whole war was just a big surprise party for Naruto. Seelentau 愛議 01:28, August 21, 2013 (UTC) :::::So we're talking about the current moments in the war is on October 9's night. Day 1 is October 8's day and Night 1 is October 8's night, Day 2 is October 9's day. That's all http://i1283.photobucket.com/albums/a553/anaspet06/Shakhmootssign_zps2a261e68.png(Contact) 06:02, August 21, 2013 (UTC) Sasuke vs. White Zetsu Army I was wondering if I could add a small section that summarizes Sasuke's battle against the White Zetsu Army, since it technically is a fight that occurred during the War. KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 23:48, September 14, 2013 (UTC) Nothing relevant that happens, really.--RexGodwin (talk) 04:34, September 15, 2013 (UTC) :Sasuke was not apart of the war, for either side. He doesn't get involved in the war per say until he teams up with Itachi to fight Kabuto.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 01:39, September 16, 2013 (UTC) Kakashi vs. Obito Section I was wondering if it would be okay to split all of the information from Kakashi and Obito's battle in Kamui's Dimension into it's own separate section since it was not connected to anything at the main battlefield and took place in a separate location.--KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 04:41, January 2, 2014 (UTC) :Not sure. The battle between Kakashi and Obito, while mostly taking part in the other dimension, began in the main battlefield, and it's not like we saw much of it in the Kamui dimension either. Omnibender - Talk - 20:25, January 2, 2014 (UTC) ::I am going to add it if there is no clear decision. The wiki higher-ups can then decide whether or not they want to keep it or discard it.--KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 20:59, January 2, 2014 (UTC) :::Adding something when others didn't pipe is is generelly frowned upon. That being said, the battle between the two of them was generally part of the first battle, just slightly taking place in a different location. Not to mention, in terms of a battle of this war, it was very very short. Most of the section you added had to do with their little discussion, which in terms of the battle means nothing. :::Basically, it's not a needed section.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 21:57, January 2, 2014 (UTC) First Battle Against the Eye of the Moon Plan location What exactly did we use to determine that it happened in Land of Lightning? I ask because if this scale comparison is accurate, that battle and those that followed it really took place in the Land of Frost, near the border with the Land of Hot Water. Omnibender - Talk - 21:32, May 15, 2014 (UTC) :Bumping. Omnibender - Talk - 04:33, May 22, 2014 (UTC) Result? Uh, considering that Akatsuki's objective was accomplished, casting IT, does that mean that technically Akatsuki won the war? Or are we going to see this play out until the rest of the world is released from it? Omnibender - Talk - 04:33, May 22, 2014 (UTC) :The goal was to cast it and it succeeded, although is Madara "Akatsuki" ? Black Zetsu counts I guess, tho--Elveonora (talk) 10:12, May 22, 2014 (UTC) ::Eh. Good point. I would say yeah might as well. As long as there is a "Shinobi Alliance" with all the shinobi under one flag, the war is still going on. :::And Madara is Akatsuki on technicality. He was raised as part of Akatsuki's fighting force and for all intensive purposes, his every action was Akatsuki's intended goal for the war. For simplicity sake, yeah he's Akatsuki as far as the war is concerned.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 10:53, May 22, 2014 (UTC) ::::His goal is to have everyone under the genjutsu, the people that haven't been caught already are the ones who are able to actually cause him trouble, too early to call him the winner. TricksterKing (talk) 11:11, May 22, 2014 (UTC) :::::The Akatsuki's goal for this battle was achieved, so it counts as a victory for the battle, but not the war yet, since there are still ASF enemies around. Also, since Black Zetsu has been revealed to be Kaguya's will it seems the next battle will be against BZ/Kaguya and its goal will be breaking the IT. Insivel (talk) 15:25, May 28, 2014 (UTC) Casualties Anybody knows how much casualties the Allied Shinobi Forces and the Zetsu Army took in the war? It'd be an interesting fact. Starship Troopers (talk) 20:01, August 12, 2014 (UTC) :It's in the article Allied Shinobi Forces or at least was--Elveonora (talk) 20:11, August 12, 2014 (UTC) ::Well, I didn't see it anywhere. Any idea?Starship Troopers (talk) 23:30, August 12, 2014 (UTC) :::I believe about half of the alliance has died and the whole Zetsu army is dead.--Elveonora (talk) 10:48, August 13, 2014 (UTC) :::: It was stated after the first day that half of both forces were lost. That's 40.000 Allied shinobi forces dead, and 50.000 White Zetsu clones dead. Present time I would say that almost all white zetsu's are dead, and maybe around 60.000-70.000 allied shinobi forces. The last is just a guess though. --[[User:Kasan94|'Kasan94']] ''Talkpage'' 11:11, August 13, 2014 (UTC) if you read the manga you will also see that there are a few white zetsu clones left here and there. Munchvtec (talk) 12:04, August 13, 2014 (UTC) : Thank you all. Starship Troopers (talk) 15:09, August 13, 2014 (UTC) Sasuke's Revolution and Wars End So yeah. How do we solve this? Do we consider the war over because all the belligerents have been defeated (Akatsuki and the Ten-Tails) or do we consider Sasuke's Revolution the third act of this war?--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 14:28, September 10, 2014 (UTC) : I would like to say that a new article is better, but the point of the war the IT is still there. I would say a third act.--MERCURIOUS (talk) 14:35, September 10, 2014 (UTC) : The war is over. Akatsuki, Madara, BZ, Kaguya and all the Edo Tenseis are gone. The fight with Sasuke is not a part of the war. --Chrillbill (talk) 14:44, September 10, 2014 (UTC) ::We need a new arc like "The Foretold Battle Arc"--Omojuze (talk) 14:54, September 10, 2014 (UTC) : I would agree with that the war is over, a whole different fight is about to occur. --[[User:Kasan94|'Kasan94']] ''Talkpage'' 14:59, September 10, 2014 (UTC) :: Even Shonen Jump says the war is over. "The Fourth Shinobi World War comes to an end, and that man will...?!" That man, we now know, is clearly Sasuke, and the war is over. Sasuke's insanity is his own thing. ~ Ten Tailed Fox 16:46, September 10, 2014 (UTC) It's over. Make a new arc like "Naruto vs. Sasuke Arc" or "Revolution Arc" or something. --[[User:WindStar7125|''WindStar7125]] 16:54, September 10, 2014 (UTC) The War itself is over. However, I think Naruto and Sasuke's upcoming battle should have a page dedicated to it. If not, I assume the summary of the battle on the Infinite Tsukuyomi Arc should suffice... --KirinNOTKarin98 (talk) 20:16, September 10, 2014 (UTC) Aftermath Maybe we should have a aftermath for this war? Justin Holland (talk) 02:29, November 8, 2014 (UTC) Anyone? Justin Holland (talk) 00:51, November 22, 2014 (UTC) :As long as it discloses the aftermath of the war such as the change in the political environment without getting into the nitty gritty of Naruto and Sasuke's fight I don't mind.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 03:09, November 22, 2014 (UTC) Stats I don't feel that the by-battle stats are necessary. *Location - mentioned either in the header, the first sentence of the summary, or both. *Combatants - mentioned in the summary. *Duration - I understand the inspiration of this, as like the starting and ending dates for real world events, but it doesn't translate here. A real world battle that spans from January 1 to January 10 happens on all ten of those days. A manga battle that spans from chapter 600 to chapter 610 does not necessarily occur in all of those chapters; "Battle in the Land of Hot Water", for example, is not depicted in all 61 of the intervening chapters. Either this should be modified so that it lists each chapter/episode that part of the battle is depicted in, or it should be cut. *Outcome - mentioned in the summary. Really, this one is the silliest; it ''summarizes the summary. Why have both? I'd like to remove these, but they were restored last time I did that. So thoughts, please? ''~SnapperT '' 21:09, January 18, 2015 (UTC) ::Light I suck. Despite being against it the first time, yeah I'm starting to see the merit of your proposed changes.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 13:55, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :::/Shrugs Seems legit. 14:55, March 10, 2015 (UTC) real casulties figures Shikamaru Hiden has recanonised the casulties figures making the death count from 40'000 to 10'000 that count had been recanonised beacuse the books have been made canon by both company shounin jump and kishimoto due both there involvement in the project it's been advertised as such. If you want know source I got it reddit. :According to your other edit, there was only five thousand casualties and now you saying ten thousand. Which is correct? And since it hasn't been announced if the novels are cannon, it will most likely not be added to the article. --Sarutobii2 (talk) 23:16, March 9, 2015 (UTC) ::No according novel only 10'000 died in total from the 80'000 that's what I'm saying :::The novel is not canon. • Seelentau 愛 議 00:40, March 10, 2015 (UTC) ::::Are we sure about that? Why would they even be released if they weren't canon. And the anime isn't canon and we include things from it on the site.--SuperSaiyaMan (talk) 01:31, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :::::As far as I can gather, because one of the books references the Blood Prison movie (which we know cannot work in canon, unless of course someone decides it does) then the books are rendered none canon by default. And you know the usual, to hell with anything not made by Kishimoto and so on and so forth.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 02:04, March 10, 2015 (UTC) ::::::Though I haven't nor can read the book so it's possible nothing was changed at all.--[[User:TheUltimate3|'TheUltimate3']] (talk) 02:10, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :::::::I mean it's not manga canon. Of course we can and should include the novels in articles, but they are filler, they fill the gap between 699 and 700. So they are at most filler canon. • Seelentau 愛 議 12:01, March 10, 2015 (UTC) Yet some anime-only canon was canonized into the manga, like Raiga and his Kiba swords, Fu and Torune's backgrounds, Yamato's background and some more.--[[User:Elveonora|'Elve']] Talk Page| 12:30, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :So what? • Seelentau 愛 議 12:37, March 10, 2015 (UTC) ::Outside of manga =/= necessarily non-canon. Let's just say we don't know if it's canon, but considering it's part of the Naruto Project which goes past the manga, it would be strange if it weren't.--[[User:Elveonora|'Elve']] Talk Page| 13:01, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :::But the examples you gave aren't outside of the manga? • Seelentau 愛 議 13:08, March 10, 2015 (UTC) ::::Raiga and his Kiba first appeared in anime before manga, Fu and Torune's backgrounds first appeared in anime before the databook, same for Yamato's. The novel stuff can't appear in manga or databooks since the manga is over and a novel is a book in itself.--[[User:Elveonora|'Elve']] Talk Page| 13:17, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :::::Exactly. Same goes for any filler and we still have them in the articles. So why not do the same with the novels? • Seelentau 愛 議 13:18, March 10, 2015 (UTC) Well, if you know the full contents of the so far released novels, feel free to add that stuff to the corresponding articles.--[[User:Elveonora|'Elve']] Talk Page| 13:37, March 10, 2015 (UTC) :I only know what OrganicDinosaur translated on NF/reddit. But anyone can look that up. • Seelentau 愛 議 13:39, March 10, 2015 (UTC)